Author Topic: Tabletop Gaming  (Read 28324 times)

Offline gallpizi

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Tabletop Gaming
« on: April 17, 2014, 10:56:05 AM »
Howdy.

Serious question here. Anyone like to play board games? If so have you played Axis and Allies or any cooperative games?(IE Settlers of Catan/Pandemic/King of Tokyo etc).

What did you like? What didn't you like?
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Offline SWSF Hale

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Re: Tabletop Gaming
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2014, 11:25:45 AM »
Huge board game fan, gamer, and designer (currently working on a "United Nations"-themed global warfare game). I've played all the iterations of Axis & Allies, but own the Wizards of the Coast 1942 (2nd edition), which is probably the most "adult" and "balanced" version. Played a bunch of Settlers of Cataan too, also Pandemic. Check out http://boardgamegeek.com/

Without getting into a specific board game, here are some things I don't like that piss me off:
1. Your fate is determined on the first turn. Be that in the form of a dice roll or whatever, a lot of strategy board games give you an initial position advantage based entirely on a luck mechanic.
2. No opportunities for rapid comebacks. I'm all in favor of two or three players dominating a game, but if the underdog is left behind after the first few turns and there's really nothing pragmatically he can do to win... that's a little upsetting.
3. One easy path to victory. Sure, most games revolve around sum total points or whatever, but if there is game that involves a singular method of winning without leaving room for experimentation, then that game has problems. Similarly, if you wind up doing the same thing every game, that can get old.

That being said, I can't tell you how many times I've played Settlers of Cataan, and either the owner of the game or whoever got to go first won. I've stopped playing it as a result.

Axis & Allies on the other hand may come across as linear since there is a lot of setup prior to the game (each nation starts with certain #s of units in various locations). This sort of makes A&A more like a chess game, in that you're limited to what your pieces can do at certain times... however there is a lot of room for experimentation. Historically correct military operations tend to work in your favor (go figure), but there are plenty of options you can take if you want to go outside the history book (i.e. what if the US began arming the Republic of China instead of tacitly supporting them?) which is what I like about the game. You will also have a different gaming experience depending on which country you play as, which is also cool. It's a hard game to learn, but once you know the rules intuitively it can really speed the game up and make it fun.

Pandemic is a really fun and easy co-operative game. The game is very organic, in that the luck/chance mechanic can go one way or another. Different game every time you play it. It's also easy to learn and play, so if you're more into casual gaming when hosting dinner parties or something, it can be fun.

Merchants and Marauders, Le Havre, and Lords of Waterdeep have simple mechanics and are fun.

That's all I've been playing lately. One other thing worth mentioning is that if you can play a 4-7 player game by yourself and find relative enjoyment out of it, then more people will make it more fun. That's my litmus test.
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Offline Erasmar

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Re: Tabletop Gaming
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2014, 11:48:30 AM »
I haven't played any tabletop or board games since I was a kid, though I do play a lot of PC wargames, which are often based on board gaming conventions if they aren't direct copies of board games themselves. Never played Axis & Allies, though I'd love to.

Matrix Games actually has a coupon for $10 off any game they sell; today's the last day to use it. I'd recommend either Lock 'n Load: Heroes of Stalingrad or Conflict of Heroes: Awakening the Bear/Storms of Steel, both based on board games of the same names. I haven't really played either, but they're what I like: enough room for tactics with relatively simple rules and not a lot to manage packaged within pretty quick (30-90min) scenarios.

There's also a freeware program that allows people to recreate many board games as modules for it. Completely forget what it's called, but I think there's an A&A module for it, plus quite a few other strategy board games.
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Offline gallpizi

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Re: Tabletop Gaming
« Reply #3 on: April 23, 2014, 01:58:10 AM »
Huge board game fan, gamer, and designer (currently working on a "United Nations"-themed global warfare game). I've played all the iterations of Axis & Allies, but own the Wizards of the Coast 1942 (2nd edition), which is probably the most "adult" and "balanced" version. Played a bunch of Settlers of Cataan too, also Pandemic. Check out http://boardgamegeek.com/

Without getting into a specific board game, here are some things I don't like that piss me off:
1. Your fate is determined on the first turn. Be that in the form of a dice roll or whatever, a lot of strategy board games give you an initial position advantage based entirely on a luck mechanic.
2. No opportunities for rapid comebacks. I'm all in favor of two or three players dominating a game, but if the underdog is left behind after the first few turns and there's really nothing pragmatically he can do to win... that's a little upsetting.
3. One easy path to victory. Sure, most games revolve around sum total points or whatever, but if there is game that involves a singular method of winning without leaving room for experimentation, then that game has problems. Similarly, if you wind up doing the same thing every game, that can get old.

That being said, I can't tell you how many times I've played Settlers of Cataan, and either the owner of the game or whoever got to go first won. I've stopped playing it as a result.

Axis & Allies on the other hand may come across as linear since there is a lot of setup prior to the game (each nation starts with certain #s of units in various locations). This sort of makes A&A more like a chess game, in that you're limited to what your pieces can do at certain times... however there is a lot of room for experimentation. Historically correct military operations tend to work in your favor (go figure), but there are plenty of options you can take if you want to go outside the history book (i.e. what if the US began arming the Republic of China instead of tacitly supporting them?) which is what I like about the game. You will also have a different gaming experience depending on which country you play as, which is also cool. It's a hard game to learn, but once you know the rules intuitively it can really speed the game up and make it fun.

Pandemic is a really fun and easy co-operative game. The game is very organic, in that the luck/chance mechanic can go one way or another. Different game every time you play it. It's also easy to learn and play, so if you're more into casual gaming when hosting dinner parties or something, it can be fun.

Merchants and Marauders, Le Havre, and Lords of Waterdeep have simple mechanics and are fun.

That's all I've been playing lately. One other thing worth mentioning is that if you can play a 4-7 player game by yourself and find relative enjoyment out of it, then more people will make it more fun. That's my litmus test.

What seem to be some of the hardest parts about designing? How do you intend to fund your project?
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Offline SWSF Hale

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Re: Tabletop Gaming
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2014, 06:07:35 PM »
Hardest part is coming up with a simple yet persistent game mechanic. RISK for example revolves around taking over countries... more countries = more troops, more troops = bigger war machine to take over more countries, etc.

Beyond that, actual production of the game can be accomplished on a DIY scale for a prototype. If you're intention is to make a mass market game, I would specifically research the pathway to that effect, but thegamecrafter.com offers full scale production and profit sharing if you're aim is for side-hustle income.

The reality is, if the game is interesting and seems fun, people will try it out regardless of how professional it looks.
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Offline Ramano

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Re: Tabletop Gaming
« Reply #5 on: May 19, 2014, 11:52:17 PM »
Thats mostly because anything based upon a "random" mechanic is completely based on luck. If it has dice, or %'s there is no way to get around the luck mechanic. It doesnt matter how well your position is set up if you cant roll anything higher then 1 or 2. Im not exactly sure what you mean by "rapid comebacks". Ive seen people come from behind in nearly impossible win situations in everything from Monopoly to WizWar.

So if you are talking about designing a board game, I would suggest staying away from dice and random values and just stick to a base number system.

However, if you are just looking for something to play that better suits your preferences listed there, I would suggest more of a tabletop RPG such as D&D or ShadowRun. Fits with everything you were looking for, and although it still does have that "random" factor where a single dice roll could potentially screw you, your not by yourself either so you have another party member to make up for it and bail you out. And if everyone is failing their rolls, well unfortunately the gods hate you and not much can be done, lol.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2014, 11:54:05 PM by Ramano »

Offline SWSF Eidolon

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Re: Tabletop Gaming
« Reply #6 on: July 23, 2014, 09:41:19 PM »
     for those of adequate geek cred and interest. .

 
     starfighter scale battle simming in a box.

Sorry but you are not allowed to view spoiler contents.

  its epic.

  X-Wing Miniatures  by Fantasy Flight Games.  Insane depth.  Growing growing growing.  As of yet- Xs, Ys, Bs, As, TFs, TIs, TBs, TAs, TDs, TPhs, Lambdas, Firesprays, YT-1300, YT-2400, Z95, Corvette, Gallofree are produced pieces so far.  Customs pop up of course.  It can get pricey.  Use MiniaturesMarketplace.com if try it.  66% cost of anyplace else.

It's everything you ever wanted with respect to battle simming plus the chance to slap your opponent in the face.

  There are TIE Phantoms  :o    *cloak*
~J
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Offline SWSF Hale

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Re: Tabletop Gaming
« Reply #7 on: July 26, 2014, 12:37:31 AM »
I think X-Wing Miniatures looks really fun. Here is a video of gameplay featuring some of our favorite geek/nerds: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mxPFHBCfuU

They seem to do a really good job at making everything relatively to scale. I thought going to my local game store and hauling in a 10ft SSD cardboard cutout. ;-)
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Offline SWSF Eidolon

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Re: Tabletop Gaming
« Reply #8 on: July 26, 2014, 10:30:42 AM »
Nice promo vid!  There aren't a whole lot of people in to it yet, but I'm trying to change that myself in my neck of the woods.  Actually made a 48"x48" space/starscape battle board with some 3/16ths hardboard this week all nice and lacquered up.  I don't have and sweet asteroids like those above yet but working on it.  Going to head up to the LCS later today and start sucking people in planting seeds.  The way you give ships unique identity is really sweet, the Gallofree comes with like 3-4 special mod cards that give it a title and special roles.  I've got this mission drawn up where the Gal is a mobile base of Alliance Intelligence more or less and they stumble onto an Imperial patrol and it gets thick.  The mod card assortment it comes with practically lays out this amongst several other possible templates actually.  Ship personnel card gives spec abilities to add stress with comm blocks and such to enemy ships, to use target foiling and other similar actions.  It's very very cool.

Biggest ship I have is the Gallofree.  It's actually quite huge compared to fighters and the way those maneuver/range templates work with huge ships having their own unique angles and what not it works out incredibly interesting and fun.  The spec and ability balance between all the ships I've used first hand yet are awesome.

 I just started putting a game set together over last few weeks, I have 3 Xs, 3TFs, 1 TB and 1 T Ph and the Gal.  Next order batch is a couple Alliance fighters, few TIEs (least 1 TB to get a Flight, then possibly a T Def they have as well to give Imp squadron power) and at least one medium scale ship (YT1300/Falcon, SlavI/Firespray or Lambda Shuttle)

The scale is definitely awesome.  I've held a Gallofree up to a Corvette and with the canon spec of 90m for Gal and 150 for Corv, they are really really close to that scale.

My fantasy goal at the moment is to get a pair of the tantive IV corvettes, and like you said with the SSD, custom improvised except maybe a VSD or VNSD!  I've seen snips of someone using what looks like essentially a Revel scale model of a VNSD, it's not terribly off scale in comparison either.  I'd like to see an actual Medium Imperial cruiser larger than Tantive IV come out for this game to really round everything out.  A Carrack would have to be about twice size of tantive iv which is about a foot long itself- and retail stores charge$80 for them, but you can get them on MiniatureMarketplace for $60 i think.  So I dunno, that's get CLOSE to impractical, but I'd still have to give it serious consideration from a discount source ;p
« Last Edit: July 26, 2014, 10:38:30 AM by Eidolon »
~J
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Offline SWSF Eidolon

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Re: Tabletop Gaming
« Reply #9 on: July 29, 2014, 07:24:02 PM »

   After getting a few games  of this on in last couple days using my pieces. . .

  Imp Squad
   3 TFs, 1 TB, 1 TPhan

  Reb Squad
    3 Xs and 1 Gallofree


    . .I had to place another order with utmost urgency.

     +1 TB, 1 TPhan, 1 YW and 1 Lambda Shuttle on way!    They were out of stock of As and TIs though *grumble grumble*
~J
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Offline Ramano

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Re: Tabletop Gaming
« Reply #10 on: July 30, 2014, 09:57:34 AM »
Is this like Warhammer or something you created? Ive never heard of an SW miniatures game? Didnt think Lucas would give up the rights for someone to make one.

Offline SWSF Eidolon

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Re: Tabletop Gaming
« Reply #11 on: July 30, 2014, 10:56:41 PM »
Star Wars   X-Wing Miniatures Game is its title.  Its like warhammer but prepainted for most part of what I've seen.  It's done by a company called Fantasy Flight Games, full licensed.  The best prices you can find on the core game and all expansion pieces are on MiniatureMarket.com  (think i quoted wrong earlier).  They are a huge warehouse i guess with small retail front store that does most biz online, you can get like everything for 66% of MSRP which most game stores try to charge you.  I've ordered two lots from them so far, and it comes from St. Louis to Detroit in like 3 Days.  I just got my has shipped noticed Monday around 10AM and it was on my kitchen table at 6PM today.

 Units move with secret maneuver dials for each ship, each dial has a slice cut out, and there may be something like 8-20 different distance and direction movement options for each ship.  Each player sets the dials for each of his ship and places face down.  Then resolve movements, commit to ancillary actions, and attack if possible anything in range.  There are like 604mil (or something) thick cardboard maneuver/range templates used to physically measure distance a unit moves from it's front base guides (ive seen arcylic ones custom made online as well).  The Gallofree is huge in scale, it has it's own special maneuver template, turning it is a beast and you need at least a 36"x36" play space, i've been using 48x48 tho.  Most fighters have Straights, 45s and 90s.  Some have special rolls and shit.  TIEs especially good at this. Ships have diff values that correspond to attack or defense die (both 8 sided).  Defense can roll either eyeballs which are for Focus which can be used to dodge attacks circumstantially or are blank, or are little evasive designs, which evade attacks directly.  Offense rolls either eyeballs which can be used to help mod dodges, blanks, or open or closed damage blasts (general and critical) [critical results in more penalties to a unit].  Diff units use diff amounts of die.  There are cards you used for individual unit identities, some are characters (from Wes Janson and Jek Porkins to Luke and Darth) others are special use cards, like some fighters have droids, thats a card with a use, others have bombs or rockets which are cards w special uses.  Some have special ship mods like laser boosts, or cloak abilities in case of TF.  Some might have special maneuver cards they can use etc.

  Anyway, long story short it's in depth as hell.  It hasn't grown huge yet, only been out since 2012 I think so still on fringes I guess.  It can get pricey still.  I've got at least $100 in to it and small squads still on both sides (order came today!  now have 3 Xs, 1 Y and 1 Gallofree transport for Rebs and 3 TFs, 2 TBs, 2 TPhans, 1 Lambda for Imps).  I took my set up to local comic shop on a miniature/heroclix/magic nites though and a few elder gents were easily roped and then hypnotized by it.  The progression of battle and it's resolution is really fun.  It's seriously everything we've ever tried to wedge in to a turn by turn imagined game board put in tabletop Warhammer form and prepainted for uninclined people such as myself ;p

  Also a note the models I have, out of 3 X Wings none have exact same paint/battle scarring schemes.  And i've seen then primed and customized.  Saw a couple Tie Phantoms painted up to be in cloaking progress, cloaked sections reflecting starscape background.  Also got an awesome gameboard I'm working on right now.  Had to upgrade to a pitch black poly stain to get the texture and surface of desire.

  You have to buy the core set to start to get general rule book and templates and range template etc.  It comes with only 1 X and 2 TFs and some other little pieces for quick scenario battles.  each new piece you buy that isn't a model type you own yet unlocks new angles and possibilities to the next game you play though.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2014, 11:06:54 PM by Eidolon »
~J
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Offline Ramano

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Re: Tabletop Gaming
« Reply #12 on: July 31, 2014, 11:21:01 AM »
So its StarWars hero clicks. I get ya. Never played the original hero clicks but I may have to check it out. The StarWars aspect holds the nostalgic value for me. Personally ive been more into the video game scene lately. Cant wait for Destiny in Sept. We only had the one gaming shop in town and he basically gave up on it. All he sells is rare collectors item stuff now. I wish he would hurry up and just close his doors so I can open my shop. I have plans for a "Gamer's Bar". Basically a 2 floor shop, first floor has a gaming store selling stuff like this and CCGs and what not, then up-stairs I have a bar that caters to the college crowd here in town. Beloit College is I guess the best Libaral Arts college in the country and these are dweebs of the highest degree. (I guess kids call them Goth now days) Games and drinking, the combination to end all combinations.

Offline SWSF Eidolon

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Re: Tabletop Gaming
« Reply #13 on: July 31, 2014, 10:05:35 PM »

   Quite a lot more depth than HeroClix has to it for sure.  But in essence yes

   Friendly advice, in my observations any game stores daily bread and butter in Michigan metro areas has been Magic and HeroClix.  There are just so many damn players that it's impossible to not cater to them and grow from there.  The trouble with HeroClix and Magic though is comic shops are always in competition for it.  It's tough for a Game or Comic ONLY store to thrive, and a Game store that does comics half ass may as well not bother.  So Comic shops that dabble in the simple games like Magic and HeroClix can easily keep up with dedicated gamer shops.  Any time you've got a comic shop near a game shop, if comic shop is selling magic and heroclix gamer shop strugglers for years before shuttering.

  There's a new gamer shop in town here that opened up recently though, well actually they were a rat nest hole in wall and barely doing rent and now magically have a huge building and are remodeling a cafeteria sized dedicated game room.  But they stock tons and tons of in depth board and table top games, along the Settlers of Cataan and Axis and Allies fashion and then everything from Wings of War, to Warhammer, 40k, X Wing Miniatures, HeroClix and more Magic than you can shake a gnarled staff at.

  This is new shops website, photo gallery of new store might give you some ideas for your shop perhaps.  http://www.gobretail.com/WelcomeHolidayShopping.php

  This is probably the most well stocked and presented store I've seen myself in person other than a chain Wizards of Coast which of course is brand specific mostly and didnt' last long at a local bougeois mall.
~J
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Offline Ramano

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Re: Tabletop Gaming
« Reply #14 on: August 03, 2014, 01:25:04 PM »
True, but the appeal of my shop is it will have a bar. lol